Project Alberta

Has anyone read Rick Bells' latest story???? I think everyone should. Don't let them get started. I don't know how to post his column on this board, so I hope someone else does.

Very interesting. Also very frightening --- Dick.

Enmax boss bashes new power lines --- Edmonton Sun by Rick Bell.

Must read --- Dick

I think that is the column you are thinking of. It clearly illustrates the depth and degree of corruption within our present regime.

Corruption - don't think they are actually corrupt

Stupity, that's the word for the Stelmachians !!!

I'm sure the Tory MLAs who go to the Royal Glenora Club on some Wednesday nights while the Legislature is in session, don't think so either....

Anyone up for "Storming the Basteile" (read legislature) ??? Now we know why those Frenchmen got so mad, many moons ago. If there was ever a time to clean house, it's now!

Wishing I was 30 years younger --- Dick.

Sighhhhhhhhhh !

+1 to that.

Rick Bell wrote, in his September 6th column, “At the same time, four Alberta electricity companies -- TransCanada Energy, ATCO Power, TransAlta and Capital Power Corp., once owned by Edmonton's Epcor -- are going to court to stop an assessor's report later this month expected to give a green light to a new Enmax plant designed to provide plenty of power to Calgary without any new north-south lines”.

“Bryan DeNeve, vice-president of business development for Capital Power (formerly Epcor)”, said “The corporation welcomes anything that will help bring on capacity in the province and reduce the risk of brownouts on the aging grid”, according to this September 25 Calgary Herald article.

Ted Morton said “It seems improbable that at some point there will not be more north-south lines built and in terms of overall grid reinforcement, those will connect with the Heartland”, according to this November 4, 2011 article by Michael Di Massa.

Why can’t the future electricity needs in southern Alberta instead be met by more-locally produced electricity from more-local natural-gas-fired power plants?

Existing southern Alberta electricity consumers can easily use up all of the electricity that southern Alberta wind-power turbines can currently generate.

What power plants will be supplying electricity for the proposed north-south line which would run from the Fort Saskatchewan area to the Brooks area? There is no guarantee that any of the proposed upgraders or petrochemical plants, which would have electricity-supplying cogeneration facilities, will be built in the Fort Saskatchewan area.

What power plants will be supplying electricity for the proposed north-south line which would run from the Wabamun area to the Calgary area? The federal government is proposing regulations which would make it prohibitive to build new coal-fired power plants in the Wabamun area southwest of Edmonton.

What power plants will be supplying electricity for the proposed Heartland transmission line?

No one has yet proven that the proposed Heartland transmission line, and the proposed north-south transmission lines, are needed.

Can Ted Morton, or anyone, prove that the proposed Heartland transmission line, and the proposed north-south transmission lines, are needed?

I can prove that more north-south lines are needed but the math gets to be time consuming so instead I'll just try to explain it. Most people will know most of this so please bear with me.

Today most electricity used is taken from the "grid". The grid connects almost all of North America enabling the sharing of electricity. Connect a generator in Alberta and it is possible to sell the energy to California or even Florida. This means that we can expand by adding power lines without having to add generation.

Of course Powerlines are almost always added to the grid when load increases but are also added when loads are stagnant to address grid issues, like stability and quality.

Adding lines increases the stability of the grid in part because the more interconnections there are the more options the grid operators have. A thick web of high voltage transmission lines helps ensure electrical power is always available and that the system is never straining to deliver that power, particularly when load increases or there are quality issues.

Load increases with time (you use more energy than your grandparents), population and increasing economic activity (there is a direct relationship between economic activity and energy use). Alberta has all three driving the need for more transmission and generation.

The one thing we should all agree on is that more high voltage transmission lines are needed, more local distribution lines are needed and more generation is needed. We should agree on that because it is a basic fact of using a grid system in a society that is increasing their use of electricity.


Why can’t the future electricity needs in southern Alberta instead be met by more-locally produced electricity from more-local natural-gas-fired power plants?

Increasing local generation does not remove the need for more transmission lines, just the opposite. Sure you can have large generation capacity (either one big station or many small ones) connected with a single undersized line to the grid but such a design will be very susceptible to islanding, power quality problems, brown outs and black outs.

This is why a grid that has few or thin connections with lots of local generation is not as robust as a grid with several large generating stations with many or thick connections.

This is not to say that future electricity needs, or at least an increasing portion of our future needs, could not be met with many small gas fired generating plants but there will be trade offs.

First as mentioned if we are to keep the grid, using local gas plants does not mean fewer transmission lines. Depending on the configuration it might, imo likely, mean more transmission lines to avoid the power quality problems the public and economy has clearly shown it will not accept.

When designing such a system the grid would have to be able to supply power when those local generators fail. We see this with wind power. For every megawatt of wind added to the grid we need to add a megawatt of traditional generating capacity. Failing to do that results in the problem many areas of Europe has, which includes expensive importing of power, power quality issues, even brown outs and black outs.

Many smaller plants means more expensive power. It is much cheaper to generate power on a large scale, megawatts or gigawatts than it is to generate it on small scale, say kilowatts.

Power generated on a small scale is less efficient and more polluting.

Power generated on a small scale is ugly, noisy, smelly and/or hazardous. All those things exist with large generation but fewer people have to see them and/or deal with such issues.

So where will future large generation capacity come from? Well thanks to Canada's failure to communicate to the world that we sink more carbon than we could ever produce we will likely not be able to use carbon based fuel without paying a tax of some kind to "developing" countries. Which means coal, gas and oil are out unless we use expensive, and in Canada's case pointless, man made carbon sequestration methods.

"Alternative" supplies are not reliable enough for grid use not to mention cost effective on the massive scale our industry needs. We lack significant hydraulic capacity, and our cheap geothermal is also limited.

Given the many restrictions being placed on the electrical industry the only way forward is nuclear and the sooner we start building the better it will be for the electrical grid. A good example of there being consequences to any position one takes. Did we really have to put ourselves in this position? I think not but we are here so we have to deal with it.

A major problem with the grid system is it's size and latency when it comes to expansion. Generation has to be in place before it is needed. Delays are expensive. We need only look at our neighbour to the west to see just how expensive. They should have and certainly could have the cheapest power in North America but public ignorance has resulted in them having increasing loads with little new and no major generation being added. This has them dealing with double digit annual increases in their household electrical bill and a larger bill for the generation they will now have to build anyway.

If we are to keep the grid the question isn't really are new power lines needed but how many and where they will be located. The same is true for generation.






BTW, IMO, in the distant future there will be no grid as there is today. There is a trend towards loads not being connected to the grid. Right now they are small insignificant loads but over time the loads that can be cost effectively supplied by the equipment itself will increase, it will also be DC not AC. Edison will win eventually.

Shepard power plant breaks ground

$1.3 billion mega-project located on eastern edge of Calgary

CBC News Posted: Oct 4, 2011 1:27 PM MT Last Updated: Oct 4, 2011 3:55 PM MT

Calgary Mayor Naheed Nenshi, ENMAX's interim CEO Charles Ruigrok and ENMAX board chair Greg Melchin were on hand to break the ground at Calgary’s Shepard power plant. (CBC)

Ground was broken Tuesday at Calgary’s Shepard power plant.

The $1.3 billion mega-project is located on a 24-hectares site on the eastern edge of the city. When finished in 2015 the plant will supply half of Calgary’s current energy needs.

ENMAX’s interim CEO Charles Ruigrok said the natural gas-fired plant will produce half of the carbon dioxide emissions of a coal-fired plant.

“The power is still going to go back to the grid, but it doesn’t have to travel all the way from Edmonton so it travels far shorter distances, so you lose far less electricity in the transmission which, at the end of the day, is a big benefit for consumers, both in terms of losses and building a transmission line that’s not required,” said Ruigrok.

ENMAX is still trying to find a partner to help with the cost of the plant.

If unsuccessful, Ruigrok says they will delay another Calgary power plant ENMAX plans to build Bonnybrook Alta.

Located on Calgary’s doorstep, the 800 megawatt power plant will reduce the need for new power lines for Alberta's grid as it's close to the end customer.

More than 200 workers are already at the Shepard site, and it is expected that 600 will be employed during the height of construction.

Although construction on the plant just started a couple of months ago, Ruigrock says about half a billion dollars has already been spent.

Despite the cost of the project Mayor Naheed Nenshi said city council stands firmly behind it, noting that it’s good for the city, the environment and the power grid.

“This is the right thing to do for Calgary, for our electricity and energy needs and for sustainability in the future.”

The endeavor is one of the largest projects ever undertaken by the City of Calgary or a related group, said Nenshi.

More energy changes are on the way. Two giant turbines that have been built in Japan will be shipped to Calgary next year.

The turbines will travel through the Panama Canal and the St. Lawrence Seaway before being put onto special rail cars on their way to Calgary.

[ link ]

Emax is still looking for money, your money would do, so will of course suggest new transmission lines are not needed.

Once built Emax will say that new transmission lines are needed to sell the power into other markets including Edmonton.